Welcome to the exciting realm of real estate investing, where innovative strategies and relationship-building define success. In the recent Raising Private Money podcast, Nathan Payne shares his secret to thriving in the competitive landscape of real estate wholesaling. Whether you’re new to the industry or looking to refine your strategies, this episode offers invaluable insights.
Nathan Payne’s Journey: From Door-to-Door Sales to Real Estate
Jay Conner introduces Nathan Payne as a seasoned investor who has successfully raised approximately $300,000 in private money. Nathan’s career began in door-to-door sales for DISH Network, where he quickly became one of the top salesmen. His persistence, diligence, and deal-closing abilities seamlessly transitioned into his real estate venture.
Nathan’s early days involved knocking on countless doors, cold-calling potential customers, and maintaining a rigorous work ethic. These foundational experiences equipped him with the unique skills necessary to excel in real estate investing.
What is Payneless Flipping?
Nathan Payne’s unique approach to real estate investing is encapsulated in his concept of “Payneless flipping.” This system leverages buyers to make offers directly to sellers, eliminating the tedious negotiations that often lead to deal cancellations. This method ensures a smoother and more efficient transaction process, making it ideal for new wholesalers looking to secure their first deals without extensive marketing budgets.
Essential Tools and Strategies
Embarking on a successful wholesaling journey requires the right tools and a well-thought-out strategy. Nathan highlights several invaluable tips and resources:
Leveraging Software
Two key software tools, Privy and batch leads, play a crucial role in determining market viability for wholesaling. These tools provide insights into areas ripe for investment, helping investors understand market dynamics and identify lucrative opportunities.
Using Private Money
Private money can significantly enhance the ability to scale a wholesale business. From transactional funding to negotiating better terms, private money enables investors to optimize their deals and increase profitability. Nathan underscores the importance of raising private money, starting with reaching out to one’s circle to explain potential investment opportunities.
Driving for Dollars
A hands-on approach like driving for dollars involves physically identifying distressed properties in specific neighborhoods. This method highlights potential sellers who may be more inclined to sell, offering a personalized touch that mass marketing often lacks.
Building Transparent and Honest Relationships
One of Nathan’s standout strategies is his transparent and honest sales process. By fostering strong relationships with both sellers and buyers, Nathan creates a dependable and trustworthy network. This approach not only facilitates smoother transactions but also establishes a reputation for reliability and integrity.
Personalized Outreach
Rather than casting a wide net, Nathan emphasizes focusing on specific lists such as pre-foreclosures and probates. This targeted approach, combined with consistent outreach through calling, texting, and door knocking, ensures that wholesalers connect with motivated sellers who are more likely to close deals.
Tackling Challenges and Setting Realistic Expectations
New wholesalers often falter due to unrealistic expectations about the time required to see results. Nathan advises maintaining diligence and consistency, with the realistic expectation of securing a deal within the first 90 days. His coaching company, Investor Thrive, offers resources like a free deal analysis calculator through the Payneless Flipping Facebook group to assist new investors in their journey.
Conclusion
Nathan Payne’s “Payneless flipping” system offers a refreshing approach to real estate wholesaling, focusing on efficiency, transparency, and leveraging private money. By utilizing targeted tools and fostering strong relationships, Nathan provides a blueprint for new investors to navigate the complex world of real estate investing successfully.
For further resources, including a free course and calculator, aspiring wholesalers can join Nathan’s free Facebook group https://www.Facebook.com/groups/payneless or visit www.Paynelessflipping.com. Nathan’s journey from door-to-door sales to real estate success serves as an inspiring testament to the power of perseverance, innovative strategies, and relationship-building in achieving real estate success.
10 Lessons Discussed from this Episode:
1. Payneless Flipping System
Payneless flipping involves leveraging buyers to make offers directly to sellers. This approach minimizes the need for back-and-forth negotiations and reduces the risk of deal cancellations.
2. Free Real Estate Resources
Nathan Payne invites listeners to join his free Facebook group which offers a comprehensive real estate investing course and a deal analysis calculator, resources previously included in his paid mentorship program.
3. Key Wholesaling Steps
The fundamental steps in wholesaling include finding discounted properties, getting them under contract, and identifying buyers willing to pay a premium.
4. Choosing the Right Market
It’s crucial to operate in markets with active flipping opportunities. Avoid rural areas and use tools like Privy and Batch Leads to assess market viability.
5. Leveraging Private Money
Private money can be utilized to scale your business effectively through transactional funding and negotiating better terms with lenders, allowing for increased business agility.
6. Focused Seller Outreach
For a more efficient approach, focus on highly motivated seller lists such as pre-foreclosures and probates, avoiding the broad and often costly marketing lists.
7. Hands-On Sales Approach
Nathan emphasizes an honest and transparent sales process. Building genuine relationships with sellers and buyers increases trust and transaction success rates.
8. Overcoming Early Challenges
Adapting Through Perseverance Description: Nathan’s pivotal moment came when he realized wholesaling alone left money on the table. By integrating private money into his strategy, he was able to capitalize better on opportunities.
9. Raising Private Money
Nathan advises starting fund-raising efforts by reaching out within your network. Clearly explaining the safety, returns, and specifics of the investment opportunity makes it more appealing.
10. Consistent Seller Engagement
Engaging with motivated sellers requires consistency. Use calling, texting, and door-knocking methods to make sure you connect with the right sellers, ensuring a more personal and effective outreach.
Fun facts that were revealed in the episode:
- Nathan Payne started his career in door-to-door sales for DISH Network during his college years and quickly became one of the top salesmen in the entire company. This success laid the foundation for his transition into real estate investing.
- Since venturing into the real estate world, Nathan Payne has successfully raised approximately $300,000 in private money for his wholesaling endeavors. His innovative approach, which he describes as “Payneless wholesaling,” has distinguished him in the field.
- Beyond his investing activities, Nathan Payne co-owns Offer Own Homes, a real estate investing company, and operates Investor Thrive, a coaching company aimed at helping new wholesalers and real estate investors achieve success using his Payneless strategies.
Timestamps:
00:01 Efficient wholesaling method for novice real estate investors.
05:11 Structured training precedes minimal shadowing before independence.
09:26 Shift strategy from wholesaling to maximize profit.
10:18 Secured funding from the personal network for real estate investments.
14:41 Wholesaling entails identifying discounted properties, securing them under contract, and locating a buyer willing to pay a higher price.
17:10 Specialize in targeted, motivated real estate lists.
21:04 Spotify employs algorithms to recommend music based on user preferences and listening history.
25:32 People form quick judgments without sufficient effort.
27:11 Achieving success in wholesaling hinges on prior experience, diligence, and unwavering consistency in executing necessary actions.
28:16 Free Calculator To Analyze RE Deals:
https://www.Facebook.com/groups/payneless
30:27 Connect with Nathan Payne:
https://www.PaynelessFlipping.com
32:04 Utilize buyer offers to negotiate effectively with sellers.
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Jay Conner is a proven real estate investment leader. Without using his own money or credit, Jay maximizes creative methods to buy and sell properties with profits averaging $67,000 per deal.
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The Foundation of Effective Wholesaling: Nathan Payne’s Painless Strategy
Jay Conner [00:00:04]:
Welcome to another amazing episode of Raising Private Money. I’m Jay Conner, your host. This is the podcast where we talk about how to raise private money for your real estate deals without even having to ask for money. Well, my guest today has raised so far about $300,000 in private money. And of course, that’s still growing. And his expertise is in the world of wholesaling. So on today’s podcast, you’re gonna learn how to wholesale real estate in what he calls the painless way. That’s right.
Jay Conner [00:00:39]:
Painless wholesaling is the best way for new wholesalers to get their first deal without wasting tons of money on marketing. Now back in college, my guest started doing door-to-door sales and soon became one of the top salesmen in the entire company. Now, after graduating from college, he worked in door-to-door sales until he decided to get into this world of real estate investing. So now for 5 years, he’s been the co-owner of Offer Own Homes, his real estate investing company, and his coaching company titled Investor Thrive. And that’s where he’s dedicated to helping wholesalers and real estate investors acquire more real estate the painless way. In just a moment, you’re gonna meet my good friend and fellow mastermind member. You’re gonna meet Nathan Payne right after this.
Narrator [00:01:35]:
If you’re a real estate investor and are wondering how to raise and leverage private money to make more profit on every deal, then you’re in the right place. On raising private money, we’ll speak with new and seasoned investors to dissect their deals and extract the best tips and strategies to help you get the money because the money comes first. Now here’s your host, Jay Conner.
Jay Conner [00:02:02]:
Well, hello, Nathan, and welcome to the show.
Nathan Payne [00:02:06]:
Hey. What a pleasure. What an honor. Thanks for having me on here.
Jay Conner [00:02:09]:
Absolutely. I’m so excited to have you on to talk about how you’ve gone about raising private money and to talk about your wholesaling business and how it is you go about wholesaling deals and marketing perhaps, a little bit differently or a whole lot differently than other wholesalers. I know one thing that you’re an expert at is how to get, deals under contract, wholesale deals, without having to spend a ton of money on marketing. And, of course, that is, very, very attractive to new real estate investors. So we’re gonna talk about private money. But before we do that, I wanna go back to your college days. What kind of door-to-door selling were you doing and you were, like, at the top of the company?
Nathan Payne [00:02:55]:
DISH Network. Do you remember that? DISH Network, selling, DIRECTV, the satellite TV. That’s what I did door to door.
Jay Conner [00:03:02]:
Wow. I tell you what. I say anybody who can do door-to-door selling and close deals can close any kind of deal out there because I don’t know anything harder to do than that time. Did they set appointments for you, or were you cold door-knocking?
Nathan Payne [00:03:18]:
It’s cold door knocking. We would get a specific area down an iPad. You would just, go and be like, okay. I’m gonna go to this specific area of the neighborhood with Google Maps. Right? You would you would just look over and do that kind of view, and you would just farm there. You’d you’d knock. You’d If someone wasn’t there, you’d bark not home. I’ll get them later.
Nathan Payne [00:03:35]:
You just did that all day for, like, 8 hours for, like, for long for you you would do 4 about 3 to 4 months out of the year. You wouldn’t go all year. You would just work in a specific period, and then you’d be done. So it was, like, go all out, and then go take some take a little break.
Jay Conner [00:03:50]:
I hear you, man. Well, I would think that those types of characteristics that you have that made you successful in door-to-door selling, some of those same characteristics are making you super successful in real estate investing, raising private money, and wholesaling as well. What would you say were some of your characteristics, personal characteristics, that lent themselves to having you be number 1 in the entire company that now you’ve transferred over to real estate investing?
Nathan Payne [00:04:25]:
You know what I would say, diligence, determination. I know, like, when most people start something, they think, they’re supposed to be good at it. Right? But I wasn’t amazing at really anything I’ve done in my life when I first started. It was just when I first started, I did okay. I was decent. I at least had the tenacity and the ability to go out and take action. But it was just I focused and over time I got better. Sales skills improved over time.
Nathan Payne [00:04:51]:
But it was just I was willing to take action and move forward.
Jay Conner [00:04:56]:
Did you have a mentor, or did you have a coach, or did you have someone in the business when you were doing door-to-door selling that really helped you out and got you there quicker, or did you sort of have to navigate that piece on your own?
Nathan Payne [00:05:11]:
The way that they set you up, they train you for when you first start, they train you for, every day they have what’s called correlation. It’s usually at, like, 9 o’clock, 10 o’clock, where they go over about an hour of training. The role-playing, you talk about your numbers. But you get that’s the training you get. And then when it comes to, like, when you hit the doors, you get maybe, like, a day or 2 of shadowing someone, and then they set you loose. So, I had people that helped me along the way, but no nobody that was like, hey, follow me. This is what exactly you do. Let me watch me.
Nathan Payne [00:05:42]:
It was very little training, I would say, when it comes to mentoring mentoring. There was training, but not kinda I what most people would want. Right? Like, someone to just follow.
Jay Conner [00:05:53]:
And in other words, you probably would not have experienced as much pain as you did when you were out there sort of just thrown to the wolves. Right?
Nathan Payne [00:06:03]:
Yeah. Yeah. And there there’s pros and cons to being thrown to the wolves, but unfortunately, not everybody can just get thrown to the wolves and wanna stick it out. Right? Because that’s what, that’s what it requires. Right? Like, when you get all that rejection and you lose, you gotta have, a desire to keep going or you wanna quit. But thankfully, I just kept going and it worked out.
Jay Conner [00:06:22]:
Sure. So let’s dive into private money. Yeah. So how is it that private money, in your opinion, dovetails with wholesaling? So obviously, if you wholesale a deal, get a contract, or get a property under contract, assign that out for an assignment fee. You don’t need private money for that. So when are you finding that you’re using private money in your real estate investing deals, and, you know, and and how does that correlate with, wholesaling?
Nathan Payne [00:06:54]:
Perfect. Great question. So every deal that I get or every opportunity, I take it through a process where I see what’s gonna be the biggest return. What’s gonna make me the most money? And, a lot of the time it’s taking the deal down and doing a whole tail, which is for those of you that are listening to that don’t know what whole tailing is, it’s when you just take the house, you buy it, you, you close on it yourself. So while wholesaling, you never own the property. You’re just selling your interest, your right to buy it. You’re, assigning your contract for a fee. But wholesaling is you close on it, carpet paint, and then you resell it on the MLS.
Nathan Payne [00:07:27]:
So if that’s going to make me more money, I need private money to do so. I’m not gonna use my own money. I’m going to go raise it and then be able to get into the deal with 0 of my own money. And when it comes to flipping it, so if you wanna do a full-blown flip, that’s not wholetailing because wholetailing is like carpet painting basic. Fix and flip, I would say, you need to do a big rehab or a bigger rehab. You need money for that. So we always take any opportunity we have through that process. It’s like a calculator that I give away for free.
Nathan Payne [00:07:58]:
But, yeah. That’s why you would need the money.
Jay Conner [00:08:01]:
Gotcha. So really, when you’re looking at a deal, there’s, the way you analyze deals, there’s multiple exit strategies that you can consider. Right?
Nathan Payne [00:08:12]:
Of course. Yeah. Yeah. I think when people have one arrow in their quiver, one tool in their toolbox, it’s they’re gonna pass up on a lot of opportunities to make more money. But that’s okay in the beginning because not a lot of people know how to leverage. That’s why it’s good to network with others to have more experience because they can see more opportunities and more ways to make money than one. But, yeah, I would say in the beginning, if you don’t know how to do all those things, get with someone who does so you can leverage their knowledge. But, yeah, I would say, many, many tools that we use.
Jay Conner [00:08:43]:
Gotcha. It’s been my experience in interviewing successful real estate investors, such as yourself here on the podcast. There’s a common thread, not with everybody, but there seems to be a common thread that there was a pivotal moment or something changed, something changed in the market, something changed in their own experience that triggered the real estate investors such as yourself to start raising private money. A lot of lot of people I’ve interviewed started, and they didn’t start out raising private money. That, like, came along later. So what hap what happened did what happened in your story, Nathan?
Nathan Payne [00:09:26]:
It’s a great question. I would say when we started looking at leaving money on the table because wholesaling is not always the most advantageous, I would say the best strategy to use to make the most. It’s the quickest and the less I would say the most convenient and and less risky. But, it’s not the only it’s not always gonna make you the most. When we when we started seeing that we were leaving money on the table, that’s when we pivoted. And we also saw that we weren’t doing deals wholesaling deals that we felt like we could have made some money off of. We realized, okay, we’re because we’re just looking at it from one lens, we’re losing out on deals. But if we can take these down with private money, we can capitalize and make more money on these deals.
Jay Conner [00:10:10]:
Sure. So when you started raising private money, how did you go about it?
Nathan Payne [00:10:18]:
Great question. We started reaching out to people, like, within my circle that I knew of influence. My, family members, and friends, asked them if they had any money, that they weren’t using if it was making, not enough interest, or if they wanted to make more. And then, kinda letting them know about the projects that we had that we need money for. And what we would do is we would use hard money for 85% or 90%, and then we would use private for the, you know, the rest of the money that you need to get inside the into the deal, or repairs. So that way, we’re able to get into these deals with the little well, actually no money.
Jay Conner [00:10:56]:
Sure. So you can use private money in a second position or a junior lien position, and it doesn’t always have to be in 1st position, so to speak.
Nathan Payne [00:11:06]:
Exactly. Right. Right.
Jay Conner [00:11:09]:
So when you first started raising private money, what lessons did you learn, that you might call today a mistake? Like, I shouldn’t go about raising private money that way? And, how do you raise private money today maybe differently than when you first started?
Nathan Payne [00:11:25]:
You know, when I first started trying to raise it, I wasn’t very good at explaining the property itself that we needed to, raise money for. But now I make sure that the people feel comfortable. They understand what they’re investing in, what the return is, how safe of an investment it is, and how they’re, you know, backed by the investment itself. So, that’s probably what I didn’t do in the very beginning. I just was, like, asking people, but not explaining the specific opportunity. I was, like, asking for money in general, but now it’s more project-based.
Jay Conner [00:11:58]:
Gotcha. The private money that you’re using in today’s market, is it for single-family houses, or is it for other types of real estate as well?
Nathan Payne [00:12:08]:
Just single-family. That’s what I focus on. I try to stay locked in on that.
Jay Conner [00:12:12]:
Right. Same thing for me, Nathan. So let’s talk about, another expertise of yours and really what you’re known for, and that’s wholesaling. So, what year did you start wholesaling? What year was your first wholesale deal?
Nathan Payne [00:12:27]:
2018 is when I first started wholesaling.
Jay Conner [00:12:31]:
Okay. So 2018. Yeah. So you’ve been wholesaling since 2018, and you know a lot of other wholesalers probably. Right?
Nathan Payne [00:12:40]:
Oh, yeah. Of course.
Jay Conner [00:12:41]:
What market do you invest in or markets do you invest in primarily?
Nathan Payne [00:12:46]:
So primarily in Salt Lake City, Utah, but, I’ve done nationwide wholesaling all over. I’ve done deals in several states. I live in Canada right now, so I wholesale virtually. So, yeah, done them all over, but I would say Salt Lake City, Utah.
Jay Conner [00:13:01]:
Worldwide virtually as 600. So what would you say are some unique ways that you go about the wholesaling business that is perhaps different from what some other wholesalers do?
Nathan Payne [00:13:16]:
I would say it’s my approach to working with sellers. It’s like the sales process that I use. It’s very transparent and, open and I would say honestly. Because the thing is, like, a lot of when a lot of people start wholesaling, they might feel like it’s not very, like, they might be lying to people. Right? They might feel like it’s not they’re not being very honest with the seller by saying, yes, I’m gonna buy it myself. And then they have to go find a buyer. So the way I approach it is completely different in my sales process, which we can go into. So that’s one way.
Nathan Payne [00:13:50]:
Another way is my relationships, it is completely different. Like, my relationships with my buyers, I think that one of the greatest ways to sell deals is just by having great relationships. When I first started, I didn’t have, good, connections or relationships with my buyers. So I would just blast all my deals out and hope someone responds and wanna buy my deal. But now, I move most of my deals or work with deals directly with buyers that I know. And, so I would say that that’s kind of the difference in the sales process and, how I work with buyers and other wholesalers to, help them move their deals as well.
Jay Conner [00:14:29]:
What’s the best advice or or piece of advice that you would give, say to a new real estate investor who wants to start in wholesaling? Where do they start? How do they start?
Nathan Payne [00:14:41]:
That’s a great question. So, you know, it’s there’s a lot of steps to wholesaling. It’s a very simple concept. Right? It’s like finding a discounted property, getting it under contract, or finding and then finding someone that will buy you and pay more than you have it for. But I would say to start, you have to make sure that you’re in a market that you understand and you pick one market. Like a good market because a lot of people spend a lot of time in maybe a market where there’s not a lot of flipping going on, not a lot of opportunities. So they’ll get stuff and it’ll be easy to come by. Right? In rural areas, a lot of the time you can find a lot of properties, but it’s very difficult to find, cash buyers that will buy them for you.
Nathan Payne [00:15:19]:
So I would say the first place is just to make sure you’re in the right market.
Jay Conner [00:15:24]:
Okay. So, well, how do you how do you find out if you’re in the right market? Like, how do you research the market?
Nathan Payne [00:15:31]:
So the way what we have people use is you can use software to determine if it’s a good market. We like the software Privy, batch leads. You can see the invest the investor activity. You can see how many properties have been purchased, in that property by cash buyers that have been purchased and then sold, within a year or year and a half, and you can determine that way. That’s a that’s a good way to do it. So, we use software. That’s that would be my answer.
Jay Conner [00:15:57]:
Okay. We have, one of our viewers and listeners that just submitted a question, so I’ll read it off to you. And the question is, how do you use private money to scale your wholesale business? Just structure terms with a lender to buy more properties, or do you use their money as transactional funding?
Nathan Payne [00:16:16]:
I would say you could use all all the above to that question. So you can use, transactional funding. It’s good for double closes. If you do more deals with, your private money lenders or hard money lenders, you can negotiate better terms. I would say that that would be the best way. It’s just do more deals. They trust you with more money or they trust you with the money they’re giving you continuously, and then you use it whenever you need the deal.
Jay Conner [00:16:42]:
Excellent. Now one thing that you are known for, Nathan, and that is being able to find motivated sellers, and discounted properties without having to spend an arm and a leg, at least when you’re starting. So, what are some marketing, what are some marketing strategies that you use and that you advise other real estate investors on how to get going if someone’s, you know, on maybe a smaller tight budget?
Nathan Payne [00:17:10]:
So if you’re brand new, what I suggest is kinda like what I did when I first started is I you want to, go, like an inch wide and a mile deep, which means you don’t wanna pull a giant list and skip trace the whole list and then cold call the whole list of 10,000 absentee owners. You’re gonna be very busy. It’s gonna be expensive. What I tell people to do, and this is how I coach is, that we work on specific lists that are highly motivated, pre-foreclosures, and probates. Because in most cities, and most areas, the pre-foreclosure list is not that big. So the problem is getting a hold of those people. Right? Because they’re getting reached out to a lot of people by a lot of people. But what we do is we actively and aggressively reach out to them with the right marketing message to let them know that we’re not just there.
Nathan Payne [00:17:57]:
Hey. Do you want we do you wanna sell your house? Like, I’m here to buy your house. We’re there to serve and see how we can help them in their situation. So that’s what I mean. Like, we don’t I wouldn’t advise someone to get a big list because that’s what I first did. I have a big list. I sent and spent $10,000 in mail to this big unknown equity list. It didn’t get a lot of, return calls, and I just spent a lot of money.
Nathan Payne [00:18:20]:
And I’m like, no. And I tell people, like, no. You don’t wanna do that because it’s very risky. You can get the pre-foreclosure list, and the probate list, and spend money on skip-tracing it. And, you’re not very deep in marketing. You’re deep in your marketing budget. And if you can’t get a hold of these people after reaching out on calls, texts, or emailing if you get that in this, through skip tracing, you can go knock on their doors. And that’s kinda like where my door-knocking background comes in.
Nathan Payne [00:18:45]:
Like, that doesn’t cost any money. Knock on their door. Leave them a flyer. Tell them you’re there to help., If you stay consistent and, on top of it, and your follow-up is strong, you’ll get a deal.
Jay Conner [00:18:56]:
So I was gonna ask you as far as reaching out to these potentially motivated, sellers. Mhmm. Are you reaching out to them with just one method or, consistently? Or are you reaching out to them consistently in multiple ways such as direct mail, outbound calling, you mentioned door knocking, outbound texting, and all those different ways to communicate?
Nathan Payne [00:19:22]:
Great question. So what I advise is you get the list, right, and you start with calling and texting. And that’s not like I don’t recommend an autodialer because those don’t are I don’t think very effective. Especially when you’re calling a lot of people, a lot of those numbers will get flagged as spam. I recommend just getting your cell phone or getting a Google Voice number and just calling through the list 1 by 1. Call the numbers and determine who if you can when you can get a hold of the right person. And you might have a couple numbers that return with some like, when you skip trace John, you might have 3 or 4 numbers. But your goal is to get a hold of John.
Nathan Payne [00:19:59]:
Right? So you’re gonna do that through calling and texting. If you do that through the numbers he has and you can’t get a hold of him, call some of his relatives. If they ask him, hey. I tried to get a hold of John trying to help him. I think he’s in pre-foreclosure. I’d like to help. That’s how we work with people. Now if you can’t get a hold of him through calling and texting, that’s basically on your phone and doesn’t cost you more money.
Nathan Payne [00:20:18]:
You already have a cell phone. Go knock on the door. Right? If you knock on the door and he doesn’t answer, then, send them to write a handwritten letter to the mailing the addresses that came back when you skip trace them. So it’s a process of what the fastest and easiest way to get all of them is by calling text. K. You gotta work a little harder. Go knock. Right? It’s just it’s just a process to get a hold of the right person.
Jay Conner [00:20:41]:
Sure. What’s your opinion on driving for dollars? And I think most of the people listening to the show know what we mean by driving for dollars. But first of all, tell people what is driving for dollars. What do we mean by that? And then what’s your opinion of that as far as is a good use of someone’s time to find, potentially motivated sellers?
Nathan Payne [00:21:04]:
Yeah. So driving for dollars, if none of you know what that means, it just means going around neighborhoods, looking at specific areas where you’re marketing or you’re doing your business, and looking for homes that look distressed. And what does a distressed home mean? That means it looks like it needs paint, It needs, like on the outside, maybe there’s some broken windows, tall grass. Looks like it potentially is vacant. Garbage cans are full, or they’re out on the side of the road and you can notice that they have not been, taken out or like they’ve just been there for a long time. It’s just you’re looking for any signs of distress to say, hey, this person might be interested in selling, or if you say, hey, they might be interested in selling because they can’t keep up with the upkeep of the home. Right? So that’s what driving for dollars is. You’re just marking properties, writing down a list, and getting a list of homes that you believe have one of the indicators of the 4 pillars of motivation, which is the condition is not good.
Nathan Payne [00:21:59]:
You still have to know if they’re motivated, you know if the price is right, and why they’re selling. But at least you know at least one upfront that the condition is, needs help. Is that is that decent, Jay? Explaining what driver’s dollars are.
Jay Conner [00:22:13]:
Sure. So have you done it? Do you advise it? Or does it depend on the individual and how much time they have etcetera?
Nathan Payne [00:22:22]:
Great. Great question. So, I did driving for dollars a lot when I first got started. What I advise the people clients that I work with, they say, I wouldn’t just hop in the car and start driving around. What I would do is, drive for dollars with purpose. So that means if you’ve called your pre-foreclosure list, if you’ve, texted them, you can’t get a hold of them, it’s time to you’ve you’ve narrowed it down to, I haven’t been able to get a hold of 20 people. Go knock on those doors while you’re going to drive to those people’s homes. Then if you notice anything, drive for dollars.
Nathan Payne [00:22:54]:
You’re because you’re intentionally going to a specific home. Or if you’re going to an appointment, intentionally get there 15 minutes early and drive around the property. But I wouldn’t just set aside 8 hours to drive all day because I think there’s a better way of going about it. So do it, but do it intentionally.
Jay Conner [00:23:11]:
Well, I love your advice on that point because it’s they’re already that they’re already going, as you say, to a specific property. Right? So you’re gonna be making that trip anyway. What you’re doing is you’re leveraging that time, as you say, by getting there 15, 20 minutes earlier. Take your take a look at what’s around. And you know what I love about that advice? I do not know why it is. I don’t see see if you, if this has happened to you as well, Nathan. Yeah. I have not intentionally tried to buy 5 houses within half a mile of each other, but I have.
Jay Conner [00:23:50]:
Yeah. I have. It’s like Right. It’s like, why am I buying all these houses that are right around each other? I mean, the neighborhood itself was not distressed. But for some I mean, I don’t know if it was something in the water that those people were drinking. I don’t know. But it seems that I have bought houses in pockets, you know, like together. Have you run into that?
Nathan Payne [00:24:14]:
Yeah. That seems to be, happening quite a bit in Salt Lake City. We tend to do more deals in specific areas of the, like, the suburbs of Salt Lake. I don’t know why that is either. Maybe I don’t know. I don’t I don’t have an answer. I understand what you’re saying though.
Jay Conner [00:24:31]:
If I had the answer to that, then I’d know where to go to market. And then and then just, you know, canvas that whole area right there.
Nathan Payne [00:24:38]:
Do you know what I think it might be? This is just a thought. I think that sometimes when those people in those areas, in those pockets see a flipper that is going in and fixing up a property, maybe they in the back of their head, like, you know, that might be something I’m open to. Maybe I might be open to selling my property and having someone take over.
Jay Conner [00:24:55]:
Yep. Could be. Could be. Now, Nathan, you have coached, a lot of clients, and a lot of real estate investors, showing them how to wholesale the quote-unquote a painless way.
Nathan Payne [00:25:09]:
That’s right.
Jay Conner [00:25:12]:
And so since you’ve got so much experience in working with other real estate investors and coaching them on wholesaling and etcetera, what common threads have you seen as far as mistakes that new wholesalers make or that you may warn them against? Or do you see them still doing it?
Nathan Payne [00:25:32]:
You know, this is a common theme that just keeps on coming back to my mind all the time I think a lot of people don’t think this business they don’t think it works or they just don’t think it works for them. And it’s because they haven’t taken the action that’s required to see the results they need. That’s what I just keep seeing. I think the problem is people, say they judge too quickly if this is for them or not, but without putting in enough work to see the results. Does that make sense? So, like, if they’ll call, like, 10, 20 people and then they don’t get a deal, they’re like, oh, this doesn’t work. And it’s I relate it let’s relate it to door to door. I go knock 20 doors, and I don’t get a, sell a dish account. And I can say, oh, this doesn’t work.
Nathan Payne [00:26:14]:
Well, no. It’s because you haven’t knocked on enough doors. You’re not good enough to knock 20 doors and close one. Maybe in the future, you will because you’re good. You’ll get better. And so I would say that’s the biggest mistake is people thinking, I know a lot of students that, clients I work with, they they are like, hey, how fast can I get a deal? Like, that’s that’s kind of the wrong question. Right? It’s like they wanna you wanna say, hey, how fast can you take action enough to learn this business? Because this is a business. It’s not like, hey.
Nathan Payne [00:26:43]:
You snap your fingers, and you make $30,000, like, as much as people want to seem. So you have to build up. So I would say that’s the big that’s the biggest mistake is having the wrong expectations.
Jay Conner [00:26:54]:
I would think one common question that you get from your coaching clients is, really, how much time do I need in order to be successful at this? They they probably everyone I’ve asked you before they enroll with you to work together. And what is your what is your answer to that?
Nathan Payne [00:27:11]:
It all depends on the experience that you have. Right? Because I came into wholesaling, with 6 years of door-to-door sales experience. And I still was not good at talking to people when it came to this sales process. It’s completely different. So it depends on their business experience, their diligence, like, how diligent they’re gonna be with staying consistent with their process. But I would say if you’re diligent and you keep hitting these KPIs, if you work, if you call 40 people a day, if you get a hold of 15, you stay consistent, you’re going to get a deal within 90 days. The problem is, if they don’t see those results, it’s, well, it’s we probably haven’t been that consistent. So 90 days is my answer if you’re consistent with the actions you need to take.
Jay Conner [00:27:54]:
Perfect. Well, the name of your wholesaling coaching company is Investor Thrive. Tell the audience about Investor Thrive and, what that process sort of looks like, and then, of course, how can they go apply to, perhaps work with you. And I think you mentioned a free calculator somewhere you got.
Nathan Payne [00:28:16]:
Yeah. Yeah. So in my Facebook group, Painless, Flipping. It’s a Painless Flipping group. What it’s called, you can type that in if you guys see the link below. But it’s just a Painless Flipping free Facebook group. But if you join and you add your email where we send you a gift, we’ll send you the exact calculator that I use to analyze my deals and whether I should wholesale, fix and flip wholetail, BRRRR, you name it. We just take it through all the processes, all the processes we have.
Nathan Payne [00:28:40]:
But, that’s that’s the calculator. And sorry, Jay, what was the what was after that?
Jay Conner [00:28:45]:
Yeah. I was gonna say, hold up right there. I want everybody to know that how you spell your name. Yeah. For those that are listening on the audio podcast, that’s painless, which is p a y n e l e s s, painless, p a y n e l I can’t even talk. P a y n e for painless, l e s s. Say the name of that Facebook group again for the easy way for them to find it.
Nathan Payne [00:29:10]:
Painless flipping. Just type in painless flipping, like my last name Payne, p a y n e, Nathan Payne. Painless flipping-free Facebook group. You type that in, you’re gonna find it. And then when you join, just throw your email in when we ask the first question. Hey. What’s your email so we can send you a free gift? That’s the gift you’ll get.
Jay Conner [00:29:27]:
Awesome. Now, tell everybody a little bit about your free Facebook group, and how that works.
Nathan Payne [00:29:33]:
Yeah. So I created the free Facebook group because a lot of people don’t know where to start. Right? So the free Facebook group, it’s not just another one of those I think there might be like 10 like a 100000000 Facebook group on Facebook. So everybody knows it’s a part of probably a ton of Facebook groups. So what this one is, it’s, it’s a free course. So when you get in there, we get you the calculator for free. But there’s a free course in the guide section where you can go through and you can see my exact painless flipping process of how I do deals with agents. And then you can relate the sales process that I do and the way of finding deals to really any strategy.
Nathan Payne [00:30:09]:
But it’s just a free course that I’ve spent a lot of time on. I used to charge for the course. I used to charge it was $10,000 for the mentorship. But I put the course in there for free because now we offer something a lot more in-depth. So now we’re giving away, that course for free in there. So that’s that’s the free Facebook group. And I can kinda explain, Jay, if you’d like what my process is and why and how my program is, I would call it it’s not I don’t like to call it a program. I call it an apprenticeship.
Nathan Payne [00:30:35]:
That’s what I offer. I can kinda explain how we work with people now.
Jay Conner [00:30:39]:
Sure. Go ahead.
Nathan Payne [00:30:41]:
So, painless flipping. What painless flipping is, it’s it’s a process of, leveraging buyers to make offers for you versus you. With most wholesalers, they don’t know what to offer. It’s a kind of a problem. It’s a big problem. Right? They’ll be talking to a seller, and the seller will want the retailer to close normally. Right? Unless they lowball themselves and then you’re already in the money. But that usually doesn’t happen.
Nathan Payne [00:31:06]:
So most sellers want they look at Zillow and they say they they want Zillow. So we have relationships with buyers, that we work with. And this is called painless flipping us. Working the painless way. Where you connect with buyers and if you have a motivated seller, instead of just making a low offer and hoping it’s low enough and not having to come back and renegotiate later, which a lot of people do. They cancel contracts. We just tell the seller like, hey, this is where I would need to be for me to buy it. You give them the offer where it’s a no-brainer for you to work with.
Nathan Payne [00:31:37]:
Usually, they they say no. Then you say, okay. No problem. If that doesn’t work for you, I know a couple of buyers that I work with that might be able to pay more than me. Do you mind if I just check with them and see if that’s something, maybe they may be able, to pay you a little bit more than I could. And then you just go leverage you you leverage your buyers, see where they would be. You don’t have to get under you can get under contract if you want to. You don’t have to, since you have those relationships with your buyers. And then you can leverage their offers to, get the deal done.
Nathan Payne [00:32:04]:
And usually, since you have all those different offers that are coming from your buyers, you can go back to the seller and say, hey. I know you didn’t accept my offer at 77100000. Right? I got a couple most of the couple buyers I use, they’re they’re around 720, 730. And I know you wanted 800,000, but this is what the market’s saying. Like, this is what people were saying. So, you know, we could potentially get you 7 20 if that would work. So you’re leveraging your buyers. The painless way way I would say instead of saying, yes, I can pay this and then going back and forth or having to cancel contracts, you’re just leveraging your relationships to, do it without all the back and forth.
Nathan Payne [00:32:43]:
And I would say, lying. Right? Because if you don’t know, don’t just throw out a number. And I think that’s why wholesaling gets a bad rap. A lot of people are new. They just throw out a number, get people under contract, and they cancel. And I just think there’s a better way to do it.
Jay Conner [00:32:58]:
I love it. I love the process. And I love it because you’re starting from a position of I mean, in your conversations with sellers of, here, I’m here to serve you, and, I wanna see if I can help out kind of thing.
Nathan Payne [00:33:11]:
Exactly.
Jay Conner [00:33:12]:
That’s wonderful. Nathan, I love the approach. I love your heart, man. I can’t wait to see you at our upcoming mastermind meeting. And, there you have it, my friends. Be sure and check out. Take advantage of Nathan’s, free gift that he’s offering thereon, on the calculator. You got https://www.PaynelessFlipping.com.
Jay Conner [00:33:30]:
Go to Facebook group and, search in Facebook groups for https://www.Facebook.com/groups/payneless. Nathan, God bless you. Thank you so much for joining me today on the show.
Nathan Payne [00:33:39]:
I appreciate you having me. And if anybody wants to chat, I’d love to chat. Not any no strings attached. I just love to help and see how I can help you in your journey. So go to painlessfluid.com and book a call if you just wanna see how our process might be able to help you. We don’t do programs, like, in the sense of, like, hey, jump in and work with us, and you’re gonna have 100 people on one call. We do an apprenticeship model where can we work with you directly, and we help you through your deals. Right? So we’ll help you get them under contract.
Nathan Payne [00:34:09]:
We’ll tell you what to offer. You can partner with us if you want, or we’ll just tell you what to do. So it’s a lot more hands-on. That’s what we’ve noticed that people need. So that’s what we’re doing over at the Painless Flipping. We’re we’re making it painless for people who wanna learn as well.
Jay Conner [00:34:22]:
I love it. That’shttps://www.PaynelessFlipping.com, p a y n e, just like Nathan’s last name. https://www.PaynelessFlipping.com. Thank you so much, Nathan. Talk to you soon.
Nathan Payne [00:34:36]:
It was a pleasure. Thank you.
Jay Conner [00:34:37]:
Thank you. Well, there you have it. Another amazing episode of Raising Private Money with Jay Conner. I appreciate you being here with me, and I really, really appreciate, you subscribing, rating, and reviewing. That feedback really helps us out. If you happen to be watching on YouTube, be sure and click that bell so you don’t miss out on any of the upcoming amazing episodes. And I look forward to seeing you right here on the next episode of Raising Private Money.
Narrator [00:35:07]:
Are you feeling inspired by the knowledge you gained in this episode? Then head over to www.JayConner.com/MoneyGuide. That’s www.JayConner.com/MoneyGuide, and download your free guide that shares seven reasons why private money will skyrocket your real estate investing business right now. Again, that’s www.JayConner.com/MoneyGuide to get your free guide. We’ll see you next time on Raising Private Money with Jay Conner.