The digital age has transformed the real estate industry, opening new avenues for investors to find those all-important motivated sellers. In a recent episode of the Raising Private Money Podcast, digital marketing expert Brandon Bateman, founder of Bateman Collective, joined host Jay Conner to discuss effective strategies for real estate investors. Specializing in online lead generation, Brandon’s insights reveal tactics to allocate budgets and target geographic areas to maximize return on investment (ROI) through Pay-Per-Click (PPC) campaigns.
Crafting Budget Strategies for PPC Campaigns
Underpinning any successful digital marketing initiative is a sound budget strategy. According to Brandon, it’s vital to consider budget allocation over a six-month period to allow PPC campaigns sufficient time to optimize and gather meaningful data. He warns against high budgets over short timeframes and suggests sustainable investments for at least half a year. Market size plays a crucial role, as smaller markets may not require hefty budgets, and overinvestment can lead to inflated ad costs. Brandon’s company tailors its approach based on client goals, recommending specific channels like Google and Facebook to dovetail with market performance.
The Role of SEO in Long-Term Lead Generation
When it comes to long-term growth, Search Engine Optimization (SEO) stands out as a strategy with potentially the best ROI. While SEO leads aren’t instantaneous like those from PPC, they are earned through diligent optimization and can prove highly valuable over time. Jay Conner and Brandon delved into this, discussing the patient, strategic game of SEO and how it fits into a diversified marketing strategy for real estate investors.
The Power of Data-Driven Decisions
Bateman Collective’s success hinges on a data-driven approach. The company shuns predictions, instead making marketing decisions based on real-world channel performance. This empowers clients to invest in digital marketing without guarantees of a specific number of leads—an approach divergent from the pay-per-lead model, but one that can build more sustainable long-term growth. Clients typically start with monthly investments ranging from $3,250 to $15,000, scaling as required, and these budgets are tailored to the client’s objectives and the market conditions.
Navigating PPC and Pay Per Lead
PPC campaigns enable businesses to directly own their data and strategy, a contrast to buying leads from third parties. Brandon underscores that while pay-per-lead might tempt with its simplicity, the quality of leads can differ drastically, and it doesn’t grant the control or data ownership that PPC offers. Moreover, utilizing PPC correctly demands specific expertise, leading many businesses to consider outsourcing this aspect of their marketing.
The Art of Lead Generation and Campaign Optimization
PPC, pay-per-lead, and SEO have distinctive roles in marketing, depending on the needs and goals of a business. For those looking to generate motivated seller leads through digital channels, it’s crucial to employ the right tools and techniques. Bateman Collective’s service suite includes ad creation, targeting, budget management, and leading up to the point of lead generation. After that, the client takes over. This synopsis also hints at optimizing campaigns based on lead feedback, ensuring continuous improvement in lead quality.
Channel Selection: Google vs. Microsoft vs. Facebook
The conversation with Brandon Bateman highlighted the importance of selecting the right platform for PPC campaigns. Google reigns supreme in volume, but Microsoft platforms like Bing offer cost-effective alternatives with lower volume. Facebook’s targeting capabilities allow for reaching a broad audience and can be compared to modern-day TV advertising, with a greater potential for lead quality improvements when managed adeptly.
Conclusion: Commitment to Quality and Continuous Learning
Overall, the discussion illuminates the path for real estate investors seeking motivated sellers via digital marketing. By investing the right amounts, utilizing data-driven decisions, and focusing energy on the most suitable marketing channels, investors can scale their business effectively while staying attuned to the dynamics of the real estate market.
10 Lessons Covered in this Episode:
- Strategic Budgeting – Allocate budget intelligently, considering market size, campaign duration, and long-term sustainability for PPC campaigns.
- Geographic Targeting – Carefully select target areas to maximize ad spend effectiveness without causing cost inflation due to oversaturation.
- PPC Ownership – Utilizing PPC campaigns allows businesses to retain control over their data and customize their digital marketing strategies.
- Lead Quality Variation – Pay-per-lead quality can fluctuate as it uses mixed marketing channels; and requires thorough evaluation.
- Marketing Diversification – A well-rounded marketing plan includes PPC, SEO, and pay-per-lead to cater to different needs and goals.
- Delegate for Success – Focus on core strengths; outsource expert tasks like PPC management to scale business operations effectively.
- SEO Commitment – Invest in SEO for a long-term payoff, understanding the process, and committing to the necessary time frame.
- Data-Driven Decisions – Rely on actual performance metrics to choose marketing channels instead of presupposed outcomes to optimize lead generation.
- Investment Patience – The average client spends $3,250-$15,000/month on marketing, emphasizing the need for consistent investment over time for effective results.
- Channel-Specific Strategies – Approach platforms like Google, Microsoft, and Facebook with tailored strategies to improve ad performance and lead generation.
Here are three fun facts that were revealed in the episode:
1. Brandon Bateman’s company generates over $50,000,000 in wholesale assignment fees for over 150 real estate investment companies annually.
2. DuckDuckGo, known for its privacy-oriented search capabilities, is included among the platforms for PPC alongside Google, Yahoo, and Bing.
3. Facebook ads can potentially have higher lead conversion rates than Google, illustrating the power of social media targeting and creative optimization.
Timestamps:
00:01 –Raising Private Money Without Asking For It
04:11 – Successfully doubled real estate investor’s revenue.
09:42 – Client responsibility for lead contact and feedback.
13:22 – Facebook’s reputation for lead quality is misunderstood.
16:45 – Consider market size and budget for advertising.
18:19 –Budget and goals shape client recommendations for success.
22:34 –PPC and pay per lead for marketing.
26:48 –Outsourcing PPC can lead to growth.
29:00 – Individualized advice available at https://www.BatemanCollective.com
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Generating $50M Annually with Real Estate Digital Marketing Expertise
Jay Conner [00:00:03]:
Welcome to another amazing episode of Raising Private Money. I’m Jay Conner, your host, and this is the podcast where we talk about how to raise Private Money without ever asking for money. Well, you know, the 2 biggest questions that I get from real estate investors, particularly new ones or seasoned real estate investors, is first of all, where do I get the money? And secondly, well, how do I find the deals? Where are the motivated sellers, particularly when there’s nothing in the multiple listing service? Well, we’re going to answer that second question on today’s show where in the world, and particularly in this market, can you find motivated sellers that are off-market and don’t have their houses in the multiple listing service, when first of all, there’s hardly any inventory out there. Well, I have got a good friend, fellow Mastermind member, and expert on how to find these motivated sellers on the show today is my guest. He is the founder of Bateman Collective, which specializes in online motivated seller lead generation. And he and his team do it through PPC. They do it through SEO, search engine optimization, and also Facebook ads. Well, he and his team, listen to this, generate over $50,000,000 in wholesale assignment fees for over 150 real estate investment companies each year.
Jay Conner [00:01:32]:
In just a moment, you’re going to meet my good friend and motivated seller expert finder, mister Brandon Bateman right after this.
Narrator [00:01:44]:
If you’re a real estate investor and are wondering how to raise and leverage Private Money to make more profit on every deal, then you’re in the right place. On Raising Private Money, we’ll speak with new and seasoned investors to dissect their deals and extract the best tips and strategies to help you get the money because the money comes first. Now here’s your host, Jay Conner.
Jay Conner [00:02:11]:
Well, Brandon, welcome to the show. Yeah.
Brandon Bateman [00:02:14]:
Thank you, Jay. I’m super excited to be here. Gotta say I can’t bring the energy like you do, but happy to be here anyway.
Jay Conner [00:02:21]:
Well, hey. Look. I’m not worried about the energy. If you can bring the deals, then that’s all we care about is you bring in the deals, man. And, you know, as I said in the intro, that’s one of the 2 most common questions I get. Where do you get the money? I got the answer to that without relying on banks and institutions and hard money. And the other question you’ve got the answer to, and that is how do you find these motivated sellers? And, and I’m telling you, I’m just so excited to dive in. So we’re going to unpack your strategies, how you find these people, and all that kind of good stuff.
Jay Conner [00:02:57]:
So first of all, Brandon, how are you qualified to even do what you do?
Brandon Bateman [00:03:05]:
You know, to be honest, Jay, I don’t know that anybody’s ever asked me that question. How am I qualified to do what I do?
Jay Conner [00:03:10]:
How did you get good at it? I mean, you’re finding out about it.
Jay Conner [00:03:13]:
There was only $50,000,000 in assignment fees that you provided. I mean, you’ve got a large client base of wholesalers, you know, with the assignment fees. But how did you get started doing this, and how did you get so good at it? I mean, that’s a lot of activity and a lot of business.
Brandon Bateman [00:03:30]:
Yeah. It’s a good question. I’m a pretty young guy. I started this business actually when I was in college because I was passionate about marketing. Just wanted to learn more about that. And, kind of in this what you may or may not know about the world of digital marketing right now is it’s, it’s kind of a different world completely every couple years. And what that means is it’s a great place to break into business if you’re pretty young because you in a few years could be the best in the world at it better than people that have been doing it for for 20 years because what they were doing for the 1st 18 of their 20 years was a different thing than what it is right now.
Brandon Bateman [00:04:11]:
One of the first clients that I ever got was a real estate investor. They had worked with a bunch of different agencies and just weren’t able to make it, in this case, Google BPC was the marketing channel. They just couldn’t make it work. And we were able to, double their revenue in the 1st year without any more ad spend. In the 2nd year, we doubled the revenue again without any more ad spending. Then the 3rd year, we doubled the ad spend and doubled the revenue, and got them to over $1,000,000 from the single marketing channel in their wholesale business, which together with their other marketing channels, made it, made it a pretty good wholesaling business. So that was kind of my introduction to real estate, and, that story starts about six and a half years ago. At this point, that payment collector has been focused just on working with real estate investors for about the past 3 years, and it’s all we do all day every day.
Brandon Bateman [00:05:02]:
I’ve got about 30, 30 team members that, support these campaigns and work with our clients. And, our goal is basically to be the best in the world at this one niche form of marketing, and it’s pretty fun.
Jay Conner [00:05:15]:
Wow. So, the breakdown for us, and I mentioned it briefly in the intro, but the different kinds of digital marketing that you do for real estate investors and how are they different? How are the channels different?
Brandon Bateman [00:05:32]:
Yeah. Good, good question. So there are a few different channels that we use. I would categorize them into 2 different buckets. The first one is search marketing and then the second one is social. And this is I guess before I even get too much into how these channels are different from each other, it’s worth noting how they’re different from other channels that you’re probably familiar with because the big channels when it comes to direct us on our marketing are going to be direct mail, cold calling, texting, all that kind of stuff. So what makes these channels primarily different is that they don’t start with a list. In cold calls, texting, and direct mail, you have a list of properties that you’re looking for, and then you’re going to target people based on that.
Brandon Bateman [00:06:13]:
When it comes to online marketing, we’re going to be targeted based on all kinds of different criteria, including mostly online behavior and intent, And that’s what makes it fascinating. The first channel that I mentioned, is search marketing channels. The cool thing about this is that you can target people based on what they intend to do. Because what someone types into Google says a lot about the future, and what they’re likely to do. Like, you and I met in Tampa. If I were to type into Google flights from Salt Lake City to Tampa, I’m likely that I’m going to end up flying to Tampa pretty soon. Right? And those are things that Google knows. And this behavioral data or this intent data is so much more predictive of someone’s behavior, than just the fact that they’re on some list.
Brandon Bateman [00:06:55]:
So that’s kind of the unique thing about this. The other thing that’s unique about it is these people are going directly to you. You know, it’s as if you were doing direct mail and they were just going to their special mailbox or they just have postcards from people that wanna buy their house, just looking and hoping that they could find someone to buy their house. Right? So that’s the thing that’s pretty exciting about this. So if I were to just describe each of the channels briefly, if we have search marketing, we kind of break that out into 2 specific channels. Let’s just say someone types into Google. At the top of the page on Google, you’re going to find paid ads. That’s what we’re going to be that’s what we call PPC marketing.
Brandon Bateman [00:07:33]:
And that’s a paid way to win on Google. It’s like a light switch. You turn it on, you turn it off. You pay your way to the top, and you get leads. Below that are organic results. Those organic results, you kind of have to earn your way there. So you can get the same kind of leads you get from paid ads on Google, but it’s a much slower ramp-up. And the long term, it tends to be a lot more cost-efficient to kind of earn your way there by basically convincing Google that you deserve to be there.
Brandon Bateman [00:07:56]:
So that’s the discipline of search engine optimization. So there, between PPC and SEO, you have the same types of leads, but for PPC, you have to pay for them. And then for SEO, you kind of have to earn your way to get those leads. And then the final channel is just paid ads through Facebook, which is a little bit different. It’s a little bit more comparable to something like TV advertising, for example, where you’re reaching a really broad audience. And the reality is it is more targeted than that, but b still you’re reaching someone with online ads. And all three of the channels work. People ask me which one has the best return on investment.
Brandon Bateman [00:08:29]:
It’s going to be SEO.
Jay Conner [00:08:31]:
Brandon Bateman [00:08:32]:
But what has, you know, what in the 1st year, what would have the best return on investment? That’s going to be either PPC or Facebook ads. Facebook does it through a bit of a lower lead quality, but also lower lead cost versus Google PPC is going to be be your faster cash conversion cycle, a little bit more scalable, and a little bit quicker to work than than SEO. So that’s a quick breakdown of the different channels.
Jay Conner [00:08:54]:
Sure. And your company, Bateman Collective that you founded, is when the services that you provide that you’re talking about, is it like completely done for you to where the real estate investor just tells you and your team what they want, and then you all make it happen? Or what’s on the side of the real estate investor as far as their involvement?
Brandon Bateman [00:09:17]:
Yeah. Yeah. I can, I can describe like kind of where we, where we end, and where the real estate investor starts. We kind of cover everything up to the point that the lead is generated. So that means that we’re creating ad creatives. We’re managing all the targeting. We’re managing the budgets. We’re managing the optimization of the campaigns. We’re managing the landing page that the ads go to that generates the lead, the tracking, and all that kind of stuff.
Brandon Bateman [00:09:42]:
As soon as the lead is generated, that’s where it becomes the responsibility of our client, where they have to call the lead, text the lead, email the lead, or whatever it takes to get in touch with them and try to negotiate and purchase the house. So that’s kind of the delineation. The only other thing that we ask of our clients, and this is kind of unique of us, but it is part of what makes us good at what we do, is we put all the leads that we generate for our clients into a database, and we ask that they give us feedback on those leads as to how good they were and how far they progressed into their sales funnel. And then we use that data to optimize the campaign so we can generate more of the highest-quality leads. And that’s that’s a little bit more work for the client, but what it does for us is it allows us to hold our team internally accountable for the results for our clients. It allows us to train Google, exactly what types of leads we’re looking for so we can optimize for not just the number of leads, but also for the quality of leads, which is the reason that most people when they’ve been working with a different company and they switch to working with us, they find that their number of leads often will go down, but their quality of lead will go up such that they’re doing more deals from fewer leads.
Jay Conner [00:10:46]:
Well, you know, that’s what it all that’s what it matters. I mean, you you hear people talk about, what’s the cost of your lead? What’s the cost of the lead? That’s important to know, but it’s exponentially in my experience more important to know what’s the cost of your conversion. What’s the cost? How much are you paying to get that deal? Now, of course, that’s assuming that you and your team, not you, Brandon, but the real estate investor knows how to convert a lead and take that lead down. So you mentioned that, of course, with Google or, now is it Google primary that you do, PPC, or do you do other search engines as well?
Brandon Bateman [00:11:31]:
Well, there’s only in in the world of PPC, there is only kind of 2 platforms that matter. There’s going to be Google, which is the biggest one. And then we have Microsoft, which has a variety of other search engines like Bing, Yahoo, and DuckDuckGo, all kind of fall under that umbrella. We do both. Although, it’s worth saying that Google is definitely where there’s more business. The advantage of Microsoft is sometimes that it can be cheap, but really low volume.
Jay Conner [00:11:58]:
Gotcha. Well, since you’ve got so many clients, 150 different real estate investing companies, you know, that are using your service. Have you done any kind of analytics or any kind of data? And my guess is you being a numbers guy and a digital marketing guy, you probably have. Do you have a sense as to, across the board, how many Facebook ads and leads have you to get to convert a deal? And of course, that’s going to vary with the operators. But generally speaking, how many Facebook ad leads have you gotta get versus, say, a Google lead? Because, you know, Google leads are searching for us. What do you what kind of feedback are you getting on that?
Brandon Bateman [00:12:44]:
Yeah. Fantastic question. And we ironically do have all the data because we, because we gather that to help optimize the campaigns. And I can paint a little bit of a picture for you of lead quality because when we talk about the quality of lead, a lot of people just don’t know what that means. So the the first thing I can talk about is the number of leads per contract on Google versus Facebook. Facebook’s just slightly higher. Google’s about 15.5 leads per contract. Facebook, by our newest benchmarks, which aren’t even published yet.
Brandon Bateman [00:13:10]:
Ironically, I just got this data barely. It’s close to about 18 leads per contract. So you can see 15. Thought it would have
Jay Conner [00:13:17]:
been, I thought it would have been more different than that.
Brandon Bateman [00:13:22]:
And a lot of people think it’s going to be a lot more different than that. And the reality is Facebook has a bad reputation in this industry. But people blame the channel when the reality is the strategy is to blame for the lead quality generally on Facebook. Basically, with Facebook, there are ways to get good lead quality. You just have to use it to manage it properly. We did a whole master series on our podcast just about this. So if anybody wants to look at that, just you can go to podcast.batemancollective.com, and you’ll see that we had it’s a 3 part series called the Facebook ads masterclass that was published probably a month or 2 ago where we talk about some of the strategies that we use. But, yeah, the reality is that’s not, like, how Facebook necessarily works as a channel.
Brandon Bateman [00:14:03]:
If you just go on to Facebook and run ads, more likely than not, you’ll you’ll end up with 50 or 60 leads per contract. But if you do the right management techniques, and that has to do with, like, the way that you’re targeting the ads, the way that the creative is optimized, the landing page and the form structure, and things like that. If you do all that right, then you can increase the lead quality.
Jay Conner [00:14:25]:
Interesting. Interesting. Yeah. You’re the first person I’ve heard talked about. And, of course, it makes sense that in words, you just don’t want to throw an ad up there and think that’s going to work. Right. And of course, you’ve got, you’ve got years of well, you’ve been doing exclusively for real estate investing for the past 3 years. So you’ve got a lot of data.
Jay Conner [00:14:46]:
So does the way so what is and I know this is a loaded question because it’s going to depend on the market. It’s going to depend on the operator. A lot depends. But what is like a beginning out of all your clients? What’s like a beginning budget or monthly budget that someone needs to think about having in place for them to you know, be able to take advantage and optimize, your your company services?
Brandon Bateman [00:15:16]:
Yeah. Great great question. I love loaded questions. I’ll never be able to answer them perfectly, but, you know, that’s the stuff that everybody cares about. Right? So, as it as it relates to budget, there’s there’s a few things to think about. A lot of people put a budget in terms of a monthly budget. I like to think of it in terms of, like, budget to get a campaign started, which includes a monthly budget, but the other factor there is how long are you going to do it, because your budget has a lot to do with, with how long it takes for the campaigns to optimize and how long it’s going to be take for you to get enough data to know how the channel works. So the first thing, even before we get into monthly budget numbers, my recommendation is always to give the channel about 6 months of the runway so you can understand how it works.
Brandon Bateman [00:15:58]:
And if I could choose between a large budget spent over, like, 1, 2, or 3 months versus a smaller or medium budget spent over 6 months, I would always choose the 6-month time frame, because sometimes it takes more time than it does money to figure things out. Of course, both of those are factors, and the more budget, the the quicker you can optimize. So that’s the first thing that we wanna think about is whatever number we choose has to be sustainable for about 6 months. You don’t wanna be the guy that’s, like, out of money tomorrow and can’t sustain the campaigns. The second thing to think about is your market. If you’re in a really small market like Jay, I know you’re in a market of 40,000 people. The reality is I just wouldn’t do PPC in a market like that. Usually, we’re looking for 250,000 people at least, ideally more than 500,000 people in a market.
Brandon Bateman [00:16:45]:
But if you’re in a market of 9,000,000 people versus a market of 500,000 people, there’s going to be different caps in how much budget you can spend, and you don’t want to just inflate your ad cost by coming in super hot with a high budget with a high diminishing return. So this is something where I can’t give you precise advice now, but it is worth talking to somebody who knows what we’re talking about. kind of helps you through the process of deciding the budget. And then the last thing that you wanna think about is in terms of a minimum budget. Usually, most of our clients are starting out somewhere between 5,015,000 a month in total cost, of the campaign. We do have some clients going as low as about 32.50 a month. And, of course, we have clients into the 6 figures, although it’s rare that they start there. More commonly, they’ll start more in the 5 to $15,000 a month range, and then they’ll ramp up to there over time.
Brandon Bateman [00:17:37]:
So I guess what I’m saying there is if you’re too low on budget, it can be a little bit cost-prohibitive, specifically for Google PPC, which is the number one channel that our clients start with. And I’d say starting at about 32.50 a month multiplied by 6 months, that’s where you might be in business, but plan for somewhere between 5 and 15 in most markets.
Jay Conner [00:18:00]:
Okay. So when a client is investing with you to get these leads, are they getting all the services that you offer or are they are they picking and choosing? Like, are they are are they getting the Facebook? Are they getting Google? Are they getting, you know, the SEO? Are they getting everything?
Brandon Bateman [00:18:19]:
It depends on the client. And, generally, what we’ll do is we will make a recommendation based on what budget they do have available, and also based on what goals they have. Like like, let’s just say I’m talking to you, Jay, and I ask, like, what is success in this campaign? You say success is that I get a deal a month over the next 6 months. I’m not going to recommend SEO because that’s not going to happen on SEO. Right? SEO is a long-term game where you’re going to be awesome in year 2, but you might not do as well in year 1. Right? So let’s just say we’re talking SEO. I wanna make sure that you understand what game you’re playing because the worst thing you can do for SEO is invest the money into it. And then before it starts working, you end up quitting so you never actually get anything from it.
Brandon Bateman [00:19:00]:
Right? So when we’re talking SEO, that’s a that’s a different conversation. If we’re talking about Google and Facebook ads, we’d love to do both together. And if you look at the way our pricing’s structured, we don’t charge a lot more to add to the second channel. It’s pretty it’s pretty cost-efficient. But we like to do that because sometimes in in a certain market, one of them outperforms the other by a decent margin. And it’s it’s not, it’s not perfectly easy to predict which one that’s going to be. So having both channels allows us to have a little bit more of a diversified approach, and then it’s not uncommon that we’ll end up cutting one of those at some point to to just double down on the other one that’s working better for us. So that’s that’s a common strategy.
Brandon Bateman [00:19:38]:
However, if you have just a minimum budget, then usually we’re just going to choose 1 channel and go all in versus trying to split across multiple.
Jay Conner [00:19:46]:
Right. Well, it makes total sense because you’re not going to know which one to ramp up and which one to tone down until you’ve got the data on both Facebook and, you know, the search engines. It’s like you’re sure, like, throw throw throw in, you know, firing a gun in midair with no target.
Brandon Bateman [00:20:06]:
Yeah. 100%. Yeah. And we’re super data-driven, so that’s always the goal. The goal always is to know even before we start where our money’s going to be well spent, but this is this is marketing. And any marketer who tells you that they know how a campaign’s going to perform before they actually run it and see the data is just lying through the teeth. You just don’t know. It’s still unpredictable as much as people wanna look at me and say, like, you’ve done this so much for so many companies.
Brandon Bateman [00:20:30]:
You must have, like, some predictable solution where you just do this and you know it’s going to work. It’s it’s not true. Doing this for this long for this many companies has taught me the opposite. At the beginning, I thought, like, you have you know, you do a campaign 5 times, and it works really well. And you think you know what you’re doing until you work with enough companies and enough markets, and you learn how little you actually know about what’s going to work. And real marketers are just curious people that are really eager to figure it out.
Jay Conner [00:20:58]:
Now I know why I’m a marketer.
Brandon Bateman [00:21:02]:
There you go.
Jay Conner [00:21:03]:
I have an insatiable curiosity, just like a child. Now, you know, there are pay per click and there’s pay per lead, and different companies, you know, do it different ways. So, is your client paying per lead that’s coming in or is there a marketing budget, whatever you get is what you get? How does that work?
Brandon Bateman [00:21:32]:
Yeah. There is a marketing budget, and whatever you get is what you get. You could spend $10 and get 0 leads, and you’ve officially spent $10 and got nothing. Or you could get infinity leads, and you’re not going to be billed anymore for your infinite number of leads. Right? So that’s it it’s a little bit of a different model than the pay-per-lead model. Ironically, I’m glad you bring this up because pay-per-lead and pay-per-click could get, like, put together. For some reason,
Jay Conner [00:21:55]:
they’re just They’re very different. Yeah. Explain the difference between PPC and pay per lead.
Brandon Bateman [00:22:00]:
It’s the same difference as there is between direct mail and pay-per-lead or text messaging and pay-per-lead. Like, pay-per-lead is a method of buying leads. It’s not a marketing channel. A lot of people think it’s a marketing channel when the reality is those paper lead companies are doing marketing to sell you those leads. And whatever marketing they’re using, that’s ultimately the channel that you’re that you’re utilizing. You’re just buying it on a per-lead basis instead of buying the raw marketing. Like, instead of, you know, paying 40¢ per postcard to send a bunch of postcards out, you’re just someone else is doing that, and then you’re just paying them when they get a response from those postcards. It’s the same deal.
Brandon Bateman [00:22:34]:
So for some reason, PPC and pay-per-lead kind of get put in this group together when really they’re they’re no more similar than than any other marketing channel on paper lead. But, yeah, paper lead, as for its viability as a marketing channel, it could be great. It could be bad. A lot of people have, very mixed results with it, and that’s because the lead quality is really mixed because paper lead companies generally will do a lot of different marketing channels, and they will change those over time. And, you know, so things could be going great, and then and then they change their marketing channel, and then suddenly things aren’t going as great for you or something like that. So they’re they’re they’re both viable options, although paper lead is, it is a common way for people to get into, more of an inbound lead gen type of channel without having the kind of commitment that I’m talking about with, like, 6 months and a pretty consistent budget. You know, you could just buy even sometimes a single lead if you want to. Although, I would argue that the fact that it doesn’t need like, you are forced to be consistent doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t be equally as consistent as you would be with PPC.
Brandon Bateman [00:23:37]:
It’s just, it’s just a different channel. So, anyway, a lot of people have success with paper leads. A lot of people hate paper leads, and I would kind of consider them as different channels. The advantage to PPC, though, is that you do own your, you’ll own all your data and you own your strategy, and you can adapt that versus paper lead. You kind of get what you get. So I’d be I’d be nervous to have a business based on paper lead, but I think it could be an excellent supplemental channel.
Jay Conner [00:24:05]:
Gotcha. So with the PPC, you and your team are managing the client’s Google account, and you’re managing, you know, getting the ads done for them. So for your client, are you also, helping brand them since it’s their own, pay-per-click account?
Brandon Bateman [00:24:27]:
Absolutely. Yeah. Whatever their company name is, people will be going to that company’s website. They will be interacting with it. They will be reaching out to that company, and then you can call them later from that company. This builds your brand. So paper lead is very much just like a quick hit, but not a great long-term strategy whereas PPC is more of your midterm strategy, and SEO is more of your long-term strategy. And they all have their place.
Brandon Bateman [00:24:49]:
Right? Like, if you need revenue today, then a channel that involves some ramp-up might not be the best fit for you. But most more seasoned companies are doing their marketing under their brand. It’s it has every advantage other than the fact that it’s just not, like, a quick hit. Like, you just buy a lead right now.
Jay Conner [00:25:08]:
Yeah. I love that. And I want I want my audience to but the, prospect is going to their website and filling in the information. As you just described, the difference there, Brandon, on PPC is it’s your company that’s being marketed. And the beautiful thing, it’s your team that is, you know, handling all that, you know, from start to finish. And the thing of it is, you know, and unless the real estate investor, I mean, knows digital marketing, like you and your team, then I don’t think most people are going to even have hardly any success for trying to do their own PPC. I mean, my guess is you’ve probably had some clients that have come to you that tried to do their own PPC and were not successful with it.
Brandon Bateman [00:26:08]:
Yeah. It happens. And we’ve even had clients work with us and then go leave and do their own thing then come back. I’ve seen people do well on their own PPC. I mean, it comes down to what is your value as a business owner. And if your number one contribution to the business is that you are capable of running a technical campaign on a platform for one of your marketing channels, then I think your vision of the company is far too small. Everybody has their own, you know, place they wanna be. But, I guess I guess what I’ve seen I’ve even seen it happen with some people where they’re like, oh, the way to get to the next level is to learn to do my own PPC.
Brandon Bateman [00:26:48]:
And then they learn it, and then their company does get to the next level. And then at that level, they’re like, okay. Now to get to the next level, I just have to hire an agency anyway because that’s how you, you know, that’s how you grow. Or they have this idea of, like, hiring someone in-house to do it as if you’re going to find awesome PPC talent that wants to work for you, like the real estate investment company that wants to spend $10 a month on PPC. Like like, no great talent in this industry wants to work, and that’s, like, the least job security anybody’s ever had in any job in the history of the world would be an in-house PPC manager for a real estate investment company. So and not in terms of, like, learning or growth opportunity either. So I guess I guess what I’m saying is, yeah, it is viable. And I know people who do their own PPC and do it successfully.
Brandon Bateman [00:27:31]:
It takes a certain type of person. And, if you are that person, then great. And if it works for you, you’ll probably end up delegating it at some point anyway. I’m a firm believer that a business owner should try to do as little as possible from working in the business type standpoint. And I would not call managing a PPC campaign to be working on the business.
Jay Conner [00:27:55]:
No. That’s working in the business for sure. Yeah. I mean, doing your own PPC and your digital marketing campaigns is like rehabbing your own single-family houses that you’re going to flip. I mean, Brandon, I had someone, I had a real estate investor the real estate investor says, well, I just love doing my rehabs. It’s like therapy to me. And you know what I said? I said anybody who does their rehab needs therapy. That’s what I say.
Jay Conner [00:28:26]:
Right? I mean, I mean, do I even look like I know how to hold a hammer? No. I don’t know how to hold a hammer. Good night. I’d be hammering my fingers off. I mean, it just comes down to the to the to the to the point. The more you get out of your way and let people do what they do best and then you just do what you love to do, your business will scale and skyrocket. This has been amazing, Brandon. How can the audience get in touch with you and your team and find out what you all could do for them in their market?
Brandon Bateman [00:29:00]:
Yeah. Great question. If so, yeah. If anybody has I mean, all all those questions, like how many leads could I get? What kind of budget should I have? What market should I target? All that stuff, questions that we get, it’s just easier managed on a 1 by 1 like 1 to 1 kind of conversation. So if you go to batemancollective.com, you can, on there, there’s a place where you can reach out to my team and schedule a call and kind of talk through some of these questions for your specific scenario. If you’re just kind of interested, like, if you like this flavor of content a little bit and you wanna kind of maybe start preparing yourself to be ready to do something like that in the future, I highly recommend our podcast. It’s, you can find it at it’s called the Collective Pics Podcast. You can find it at podcast.bavincollective.com.
Brandon Bateman [00:29:46]:
And we put a lot of content in there about, like, strategy. A lot of people don’t realize that there’s a lot of strategy. Like, we have entire episodes dedicated to, like, how to choose your budget. Entire episodes dedicated to, like, how to figure out what kind of geographic targeting to do for your PPC campaign, you know, all those kinds of things. Highly recommend you check that out so that you can kind of become well versed in that and know enough as a business owner. There’s, like, a certain amount that you should know to where you can be you can have productive strategic conversations, but not necessarily be in the weeds doing everything. So I highly recommend you check that out.
Jay Conner [00:30:17]:
That’s awesome. Brandon, this has been fascinating having you on as a guest, answering one of the 2 top questions that all real estate investors have. And, you nailed it, Brandon. Thank you so much for joining me.
Brandon Bateman [00:30:30]:
Yep. Thank you, Jay. I appreciate your time.
Jay Conner [00:30:32]:
You got it. Well, there you have it. Another amazing episode of Raising Private Money with Jay Conner. I appreciate you enjoying, joining me here on the show, and something that would just really mean the world to me is if you would share this episode. You know, I don’t run any ads on this show. I don’t sell anything on this show, and we need your help to just spread the word so we can have people keep listening so we can keep having amazing guests like Brandon Bateman. So if you’re watching on YouTube, be sure and ring that bell. If you’re listening on your favorite podcast channel, Be sure and follow so you don’t miss out on any more of these amazing episodes.
Jay Conner [00:31:13]:
So I look forward to seeing you right here on the next episode of Raising Private Money with Jay Conner.
Narrator [00:31:22]:
Are you feeling inspired by the knowledge you gained in this episode? Then head over to www.JayConner.com/MoneyGuide. That’s www.JayConner.com/MoneyGuide, and download your free guide that shares seven reasons why Private Money will skyrocket your real estate investing business right now. Again, that’s www.JayConner.com/MoneyGuide. to get your free guide. We’ll see you next time on Raising Private Money with Jay Conner.
